FDA wants ecigs banned...

[Dr Manhattan]

...while they're doing things like this (video) Opioid wars - Al Jazeera English

Not ecig related, but an insight into what the FDA is doing while they fight to 'regulate' ecigarettes because of 'health concerns'. Recommended watch


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[schlinky]

I think it's criminal, the motivations behind the legislation are obvious.

Millions of people are being set free from the misery and tyranny of tobacco and it is a massive threat to the tobacco industry as a whole. When billions of dollars are at stake then I expect them to pull out all the stops.

You would think they would have trouble justifying it but like the video shows, anything is possible.

 

[Tubbyengineer]

...while they're doing things like this (video) Opioid wars - Al Jazeera English

Not ecig related, but an insight into what the FDA is doing while they fight to 'regulate' ecigarettes because of 'health concerns'. Recommended watch


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You actually beleived that? it took less than 2 minutes to find this...
Canada’s the world capital of potent opioids, and that makes its neighbour nervous - National | Globalnews.ca
or this...Who pops the most painkillers? How Canada’s opioid use compares with the rest of the world | Globalnews.ca

So it turns out that Canada uses more Opioids than America leaving the claims of "America uses 80%" looking frankly rather dubious - Oh and thats from a Canadian site, not an American one just in case you thoughit might be US Bias...

Al Jazeera is not exactly pro USA, and fault lines is frankly not much more than a propaganda show...

 

[schlinky]

You actually beleived that? it took less than 2 minutes to find this...
Canada’s the world capital of potent opioids, and that makes its neighbour nervous - National | Globalnews.ca
or this...Who pops the most painkillers? How Canada’s opioid use compares with the rest of the world | Globalnews.ca

So it turns out that Canada uses more Opioids than America leaving the claims of "America uses 80%" looking frankly rather dubious - Oh and thats from a Canadian site, not an American one just in case you thoughit might be US Bias...

Al Jazeera is not exactly pro USA, and fault lines is frankly not much more than a propaganda show...

I see your point but regardless of population numbers and geographics the FDA still passed high strength opioids despite warnings and a lack of support from it's members and advisors. That's what I took away from the video.

 

[Dr Manhattan]

You actually beleived that? it took less than 2 minutes to find this...
Canada’s the world capital of potent opioids, and that makes its neighbour nervous - National | Globalnews.ca
or this...Who pops the most painkillers? How Canada’s opioid use compares with the rest of the world | Globalnews.ca

So it turns out that Canada uses more Opioids than America leaving the claims of "America uses 80%" looking frankly rather dubious - Oh and thats from a Canadian site, not an American one just in case you thoughit might be US Bias...

Al Jazeera is not exactly pro USA, and fault lines is frankly not much more than a propaganda show...

The information is there IF you take time and look for it, and from other sources if you don't like the one i've used.

Prescription Painkillers: Record Number of Americans Pain Medication - ABC News

Activists call for FDA commissioner’s ouster over opioid epidemic - The Washington Post

Americans consume 80 percent of world's pain pills as prescription drug abuse epidemic explodes | Daily Mail Online

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2012/nov/28/painkiller-addiction-plague-united-states

You need to read the links you posted again, they are making a different point. Just google 'which country uses most painkillers' and 'FDA approves Zohydro'.

The FDA approved a potent opioid despite contention from all parties involved including their own advisors, this led to addiction, death and shifts to the cheaper alternative heroin, and this is referenced as 'one of the biggest man made epidemics in the world'. And they make billions from it like a drug cartel above the law, this is a fair statement since painkillers in the US kills more then heroin, cocaine, and even road accidents. And all this while they fight vaping because it could have 'unknown health risks'. These are all facts not speculation or opinion.

 

[Tubbyengineer]

The information is there IF you take time and look for it, and from other sources if you don't like the one i've used.

Prescription Painkillers: Record Number of Americans Pain Medication - ABC News

Activists call for FDA commissioner’s ouster over opioid epidemic - The Washington Post

Americans consume 80 percent of world's pain pills as prescription drug abuse epidemic explodes | Daily Mail Online

Painkiller addiction: the plague that is sweeping the US | Society | The Guardian

You need to read the links you posted again, they are making a different point. Just google 'which country uses most painkillers' and 'FDA approves Zohydro'.

The FDA approved a potent opioid despite contention from all parties involved including their own advisors, this led to addiction, death and shifts to the cheaper alternative heroin, and this is referenced as 'one of the biggest man made epidemics in the world'. And they make billions from it like a drug cartel above the law, this is a fair statement since painkillers in the US kills more then heroin, cocaine, and even road accidents. And all this while they fight vaping because it could have 'unknown health risks'. These are all facts not speculation or opinion.

Firstly it was an outside panel that opposed the FDA's approval of Zohydro - mainly on the basis of a lack of tamper resistance, with it's actual composition being a minor consideration. Secondly the amount of painkillers prescribed in the USA has nothing to do with the FDA and everything to do with money grubbing "Healthcare Providers". Thirdly the links I posted are proving exactly the point that if Canada uses more Opiods than America then simple mathematics means that America cannot be using 80% - infact they cannot be using more than 49.9% (Otherwise the Canadians could not be using more than America)

Finally I think you are missing the point of my post - I don't give a rat's ass about the FDA they're just another bunch of Big Pharma butt kissing bureaucrats looking to keep their jobs, my point is that your source is known to be inaccurate and biased - If you'd just said that the FDA were a bunch of butt kissing pill pushers yes men who wanted to ban E-cigs then I would have agreed...

 

[Dr Manhattan]

Firstly it was an outside panel that opposed the FDA's approval of Zohydro

Yes, an outside panel appointed by the FDA as advisors, read this FDA Panel Votes Against Recommending Zohydro for Approval - Partnership for Drug-Free Kids

Mainly on the basis of a lack of tamper resistance, with it's actual composition being a minor consideration

Zohydro doesn't contain acetaminophen like hydrocodone products so you can take high doses without risks like with paracetamol. When crushed up Zohydro's composition makes it as potent as heroin.

Secondly the amount of painkillers prescribed in the USA has nothing to do with the FDA and everything to do with money grubbing "Healthcare Providers".

Yes thats not in refute. But the FDA charges millions to big pharma for each new drug they want approving before the dodgy doctors and big pharma can make their money. Do you think the FDA didn't know what big pharma planned to do when the drug was released, and what the risks and likely consequences will be?
Is The FDA Being Compromised By Pharma Payments? - Forbes

Thirdly the links I posted are proving exactly the point that if Canada uses more Opiods than America then simple mathematics means that America cannot be using 80% - infact they cannot be using more than 49.9% (Otherwise the Canadians could not be using more than America)

The articles you've linked only go to 2010 first of all, and Zohydro didn't hit shelves until March this year. Your articles say Canada consumed the most hydromorphone, fentanyl and pethidine between 2006-2010.

Even throughout this period the painkillers which are commonly abused (oxycodone, morphine, methadone) were consumed more in the USA.

Reports of the US consuming 80% of the worlds painkillers and 99% of the worlds hydrocodone (the opiate in Vicodin and Zohydro) didn't start to appear until 2011/2 - the same time if not a little before they were also reporting a boom in heroin use, and this has continued to today. This info can be found from multiple sources i've already posted or told you where to find.

Finally I think you are missing the point of my post - I don't give a rat's ass about the FDA they're just another bunch of Big Pharma butt kissing bureaucrats looking to keep their jobs, my point is that your source is known to be inaccurate and biased

Known by who to be inaccurate and biased? Al Jazeera is also known as a fair, more accurate, and non-biased news source depending who you ask or where you look. And in comparison to existing US and UK news coverage? Or do you think they are reporting unbiased news? Personally i think all news is biased to a certain degree, some more then others and the truth is always somewhere between them all



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[nikki from mars]

The FDA the WHO and in the UK the MHRA all are biased against e cigarettes, hardly surprising as big pharma will lose a lot of money due to smokers not using the useless pharmacological quit aids when there is a better and cheaper alternative. .. also it pays them for smokers to get sick and die as the cancer and heart medications that many smokers will inevitably end up on for months or even years are very expensive drugs with high profit margins. .. is it really a surprise then that they also sell drugs known to cause addiction or dependency? Or that less effective drugs which make more profit are still reccomended for cancer treatments etc... or drugs that can manage illness longterm but not cure it... not really. .. it's big business and big business doesn't have the moral compass of an alley cat... why is anyone even surprised about all of this? Al jazeera is sometimes interesting to watch as it highlights issues which our own news doesn't show because of its western centric viewpoint, but any news will always show presentation bias and needs reading around not taking as gospel as Tubbyengineer highlights. .. if you read around any subject sufficiently then make your mind up then you can eventually get to a more balanced picture of the facts...

 

[Dr Manhattan]

The FDA the WHO and in the UK the MHRA all are biased against e cigarettes, hardly surprising as big pharma will lose a lot of money due to smokers not using the useless pharmacological quit aids when there is a better and cheaper alternative. .. also it pays them for smokers to get sick and die as the cancer and heart medications that many smokers will inevitably end up on for months or even years are very expensive drugs with high profit margins. .. is it really a surprise then that they also sell drugs known to cause addiction or dependency? Or that less effective drugs which make more profit are still reccomended for cancer treatments etc... or drugs that can manage illness longterm but not cure it... not really. .. it's big business and big business doesn't have the moral compass of an alley cat... why is anyone even surprised about all of this? Al jazeera is sometimes interesting to watch as it highlights issues which our own news doesn't show because of its western centric viewpoint, but any news will always show presentation bias and needs reading around not taking as gospel as Tubbyengineer highlights. .. if you read around any subject sufficiently then make your mind up then you can eventually get to a more balanced picture of the facts...

If that was Tubbyengineer's point then it was pointless, since i never said I nor anyone else should take al jazeera or any other single news source as gospel. As i said above the truth is going to be somewhere in the middle, so its good to hear all sides. You can cast doubt on pretty much any news story posted on here or anywhere else because of bias.

But at the same time the information and data supporting the video i posted from Al Jazeera can be found from many sources. Its not surprising about the FDA at least not to me, but things like this should definitely be brought to the worlds attention.

Also the information on Canada was out of date and not even relevant to the issue in the OP, plus its also from a single news source.


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[nikki from mars]

Dr Manhattan I hadn't seen that post of yours when I wrote this. .. as it basically agrees that you have to look at various sources to avoid their biases. I am somewhat cynical when it comes to taking any info verbatim from source and also as to the motivation of big pharma etc...