Heated discussion

[steffijade]

Why would you sound combative to me?

Because you seem quite intent on trying to prove something which I think you're mistaken about i.e. that Gonloopy stated that diacetyl can cause popcorn lung, when in fact the quote you used said "potentially can".

If you are correct in your assertion that nothing has been proved, then it stands to reason that nothing has been disproved either.

Therefore, diacetyl potentially can cause popcorn lung but it also potentially can't if your assertion is correct.

It would seem that the matter is still up for debate and debate can be healthy, as long as it doesn't turn into some kind of redundant point scoring exercise.

 

[zenomega]

You are probably right that there is probably little risk from diacetyl and it will be getting less as most reputable juice makers reformulate to eliminate it.
For me I choose to minimise the small theoretical risk because it is easily done and does not impact my vaping. I never did fancy custard. Given the number of unknowns in flavour and that given that inhaling foreign substances into the lungs is never going to be good for you (could still be 95% safer than fags), I even minimise the flavours in my juices to 5% or 6% not based on scientific proof but common sense.
At the same time I ignore possible risks from metals caused by dry burning, because it would be a hassle recoiling for every wick. Hell, most of us willing to smoke regardless of the evidence that it was stupid.
We should be happy to discuss any possible risks and diacetyl is one such.
Always better to decide what you are doing with more rather than less information.
You sound like you have looked ito it and made your own decision, others should do the same.

Great post mate! and I agree with you. I also keep my mixes to around 6 to 8 percent concentrate as I believe that flavoring is the biggest unknown in vaping.

All we are doing is discussing, no harm in that. Im 61 now and have been vaping for well over 2 years and feel much better than I used to on the baccy so for me that speaks for itself

 

[zenomega]

Because you seem quite intent on trying to prove something which I think you're mistaken about i.e. that Gonloopy stated that diacetyl can cause popcorn lung, when in fact the quote you used said "potentially can".

If you are correct in your assertion that nothing has been proved, then it stands to reason that nothing has been disproved either.

Therefore, diacetyl potentially can cause popcorn lung but it also potentially can't if your assertion is correct.

It would seem that the matter is still up for debate and debate can be healthy, as long as it doesn't turn into some kind of redundant point scoring exercise.

And this is exactly my point eh? POTENTIALLY it can and POTENTIALLY it can't my whole reason for not posting such misleading information in the first place lets have facts shall we? And no your still not being combative!

 

[Mawsley]

Vaping gave me syphilis.

 

[zenomega]

Vaping gave me syphilis.

Not from Leeds are you? oh no its super gonnorhea there its ok not potentially caused by diacetyl in ecigs potentially!
'Super-gonorrhoea' outbreak across north of England sparks national alert - Telegraph

 

[MrTeaTime]

Vaping can cause extreme cuntyism

 

[MrTeaTime]

Sorry, should have said "potentially" cause cuntism

 

[steffijade]

And this is exactly my point eh? POTENTIALLY it can and POTENTIALLY it can't my whole reason for not posting such misleading information in the first place lets have facts shall we? And no your still not being combative!

Ah. Perhaps I've misunderstood but I don't see how stating that something potentially can be harmful is misleading, particularly as you seem to agree that diacetyl has the potential for harm.

There's sometimes a kind of knee jerk reaction to leap to the defence of vaping if we feel that it's being portrayed as potentially harmful in some way. I blame the ANTZ for this... we've all become so used to seeing something that we can be evangelical about attacked, that it almost becomes second nature to try and deconstruct those attacks.

In that sense I suppose we can all salivate when the bell rings.

 

[zenomega]

Ah. Perhaps I've misunderstood but I don't see how stating that something potentially can be harmful is misleading, particularly as you seem to agree that diacetyl has the potential for harm.

There's sometimes a kind of knee jerk reaction to leap to the defence of vaping if we feel that it's being portrayed as potentially harmful in some way. I blame the ANTZ for this... we've all become so used to seeing something that we can be evangelical about attacked, that it almost becomes second nature to try and deconstruct those attacks.

In that sense I suppose we can all salivate when the bell rings.

I dont deny that diacetyl has the potential for harm but so has every other ingredient in eliquid! including the biggest one which is vegetable glycerine! putting it about that diacetyl is potentially harmful has already removed it from the majority of eliquids today (although there is a surprising number of high end priced so called premium liquids that haha potentially still use it) this is definitely detrimental to the taste of some eliquids that just dont taste as good any more. If your happy for this trend to continue then thats up to you its your choice! but flavors that once tasted great will now just be meh! until the next one gets removed and the next etc etc til your left with pg only juices yep they will be fairly safe but taste like crap!

BTW is there a better atty than the Nextgen? simply superb taste best atomiser Ive bought in 2.5 years of vaping!

 

[steffijade]

I dont deny that diacetyl has the potential for harm but so has every other ingredient in eliquid! including the biggest one which is vegetable glycerine! putting it about that diacetyl is potentially harmful has already removed it from the majority of eliquids today (although there is a surprising number of high end priced so called premium liquids that haha potentially still use it) this is definitely detrimental to the taste of some eliquids that just dont taste as good any more. If your happy for this trend to continue then thats up to you its your choice! but flavors that once tasted great will now just be meh! until the next one gets removed and the next etc etc til your left with pg only juices yep they will be fairly safe but taste like crap!

BTW is there a better atty than the Nextgen? simply superb taste best atomiser Ive bought in 2.5 years of vaping!

The shinyitis is in remission so I haven't tried a Nextgen or much of anything 'new' in the past few months... subtanks are hitting the spot for me so I'm not tempted by anything shiny (or otherwise) at the moment.

As for premium juices and flavours not being what they were, personally I find my taste shifts with time and I tend to flit between juices, where what might be the dog's danglies for a while can become a bit boring so I end up mixing something new/buying a few bottles of pre mixed until something takes my fancy (fickle, aren't I?).

The common theme throughout this thread seems to be make your own choices.

Seems sensible to me, as long as we all acknowledge that we're making our own beds through those choices and so we should be prepared to lie in them without complaint if the mattress turns out to be lumpy. If we're prepared to risk back ache, we shouldn't be pulling down people who use/recommend memory foam though, just because we're happy with the bog standard pocket sprung job.

How are these metaphors grabbing you?