Heated discussion

[zenomega]

Out of order
I have clearly explained my opinion and rationale for that opinion. I have also said that you are entitled to your own. M

Why am I out of order? whats wrong with disagreeing with your opinion? especially when your said opinion affects vaping for the masses by stating wrong information I repeat it has NEVER been proven that diacetyl causes popcorn lung if you disagree with this show me the clinical tests that prove it. Simples no need to get upset is there?

 

[oldhippydude]

I repeat it has NEVER been proven that diacetyl causes popcorn lung if you disagree with this show me the clinical tests that prove it. Simples no need to get upset is there?

Did someone say it was proven?

 

[Gonloopy]

Why am I out of order? whats wrong with disagreeing with your opinion? especially when your said opinion affects vaping for the masses by stating wrong information I repeat it has NEVER been proven that diacetyl causes popcorn lung if you disagree with this show me the clinical tests that prove it. Simples no need to get upset is there?

First of all read my initial post that you have quoted me on that you have dragged up from a couple of months ago. I think you'll find I was reassuring and advising that vaping was far safer than smoking. 'Spreading false' is in essence equivalent to calling me a liar

With tha reference to no proof of diacetyl causing harm and no proof let me give you an analogy.

A healthy young man gets up one day, eats what he always eats drinks what he always drinks. He walks down the road and promptly falls into a lake full of shit. 5 or 6 hours later he starts vomiting. He goes to the doc who tests him and finds that he is ill because of a bacteria found in shit.

They didn't bother test the lake full of shit though as they felt there was a high degree of clinical suspicion that the lake full of shit was the cause.

Get my drift?

 

[zenomega]

Did someone say it was proven?

The thing with Diacetyl is that it shouldn't be in eliquids, its most commonly found in buttery/creamy type liquids. it's a risk that is known and is avoidable, as it potentially can lead to 'popcorn lung'.

Have I misread this?

 

[zenomega]

First of all read my initial post that you have quoted me on that you have dragged up from a couple of months ago. I think you'll find I was reassuring and advising that vaping was far safer than smoking. 'Spreading false' is in essence equivalent to calling me a liar

With tha reference to no proof of diacetyl causing harm and no proof let me give you an analogy.

A healthy young man gets up one day, eats what he always eats drinks what he always drinks. He walks down the road and promptly falls into a lake full of shit. 5 or 6 hours later he starts vomiting. He goes to the doc who tests him and finds that he is ill because of a bacteria found in shit.

They didn't bother test the lake full of shit though as they felt there was a high degree of clinical suspicion that the lake full of shit was the cause.

Get my drift?

Let me apologise please I didnt realise this thread was started so long ago, was simply bored and browsing the forum came across it! blimey november 2014 lol! I dont post much on here to be honest but do like to have a look at whats going on.

 

[oldhippydude]

The thing with Diacetyl is that it shouldn't be in eliquids, its most commonly found in buttery/creamy type liquids. it's a risk that is known and is avoidable, as it potentially can lead to 'popcorn lung'.

Have I misread this?

I would perhaps add known as a possible risk. It is how I read it. All in all a minor point.
This does not seem to be a disagreement about facts but rather a disagreement about what people choose to do with the same information.
People are entitled to make different risk assessments but I am all in favour of raising any possible risk so people can decide for themselves. You seem to want to close down the discussion till there is 100% proof of risk.

 

[zenomega]

I would perhaps add known as a possible risk. It is how I read it. All in all a minor point.
This does not seem to be a disagreement about facts but rather a disagreement about what people choose to do with the same information.
People are entitled to make different risk assessments but I am all in favour of raising any possible risk so people can decide for themselves. You seem to want to close down the discussion till there is 100% proof of risk.

Almost
I would like to see proven facts carried out by proper scientific tests before any scaremongering wrong/false/incorrect information is passed on to fellow vapers then and only then can we make our decisions. Simply stating that it might could possibly perhaps maybe must be etc isnt good enough. This sort of hearsay is detrimental to vaping.

Diacetyl as has been stated is in cigarettes, people have smoked for donkeys years and not a single case has been found in ex smokers. Add this to all the people working in bakeries cooking all day long in ovens must have inhaled plenty of diacetyl over the years and here again not a single case of popcorn lung!

 

[steffijade]

The thing with Diacetyl is that it shouldn't be in eliquids, its most commonly found in buttery/creamy type liquids. it's a risk that is known and is avoidable, as it potentially can lead to 'popcorn lung'.

Have I misread this?

Sorry if this sounds combative, but do you know what potentially means?

 

[zenomega]

Sorry if this sounds combative, but do you know what potentially means?

Why would you sound combative to me?

 

[oldhippydude]

Almost
I would like to see proven facts carried out by proper scientific tests before any scaremongering wrong/false/incorrect information is passed on to fellow vapers then and only then can we make our decisions. Simply stating that it might could possibly perhaps maybe must be etc isnt good enough. This sort of hearsay is detrimental to vaping.

Diacetyl as has been stated is in cigarettes, people have smoked for donkeys years and not a single case has been found in ex smokers. Add this to all the people working in bakeries cooking all day long in ovens must have inhaled plenty of diacetyl over the years and here again not a single case of popcorn lung!

You are probably right that there is probably little risk from diacetyl and it will be getting less as most reputable juice makers reformulate to eliminate it.
For me I choose to minimise the small theoretical risk because it is easily done and does not impact my vaping. I never did fancy custard. Given the number of unknowns in flavour and that given that inhaling foreign substances into the lungs is never going to be good for you (could still be 95% safer than fags), I even minimise the flavours in my juices to 5% or 6% not based on scientific proof but common sense.
At the same time I ignore possible risks from metals caused by dry burning, because it would be a hassle recoiling for every wick. Hell, most of us willing to smoke regardless of the evidence that it was stupid.
We should be happy to discuss any possible risks and diacetyl is one such.
Always better to decide what you are doing with more rather than less information.
You sound like you have looked ito it and made your own decision, others should do the same.