Flavour related questions answered

[Mr Ripple]

Hi @TheFlavourist and welcome to POTV.
Is there a simple way to help retain flavours in juice such as cherry and plum.
Its common for cherry to dissipate and fade.
I know some companies add enhancers to juice like vape wizzard but i am a simple diyer and one of the main reasons i chose to make my own was that i would know what i was vaping.

 

[Gee Dub]

Hello TheFlavourist, Welcome to the Planet!

 

[TheFlavourist]

Hi,

There are some good cherries out there, but I'm not here to promote any particular products or vape companies.
Personally I'd avoid any cherry liquids which smell like Almonds, I find them quite harsh and one dimensional.

Cheers

 

[TheFlavourist]

Hi @TheFlavourist and welcome to POTV.
Is there a simple way to help retain flavours in juice such as cherry and plum.
Its common for cherry to dissipate and fade.
I know some companies add enhancers to juice like vape wizzard but i am a simple diyer and one of the main reasons i chose to make my own was that i would know what i was vaping.

I've not heard of Cherry flavours fading so I'll have to do some research into why this might happen, but my first thought is that it it may be a function of one of the key ingredients in a lot of Cherry flavours, which tends to react with PG (it's the ingredient which smells like Almond that I mentioned in an earlier post) which reduces it's flavour impact. There's another, similar aroma chemical which is more Black Cherry like and which reacts in the same way.
You could try adding a small ammount (1 - 2%) of water which should slow the reaction down (unless it's already gone to completion . In which case it won't make a difference).
Water is added to Almond flavours for exactly this reason.
I believe that the "enhancers" tend to be just single aroma chemicals which give a subtle boost to a particular flavour element, not sure that will help here.

Let me know if it works...........

 

[TheFlavourist]

Hi @TheFlavourist and welcome to POTV.
Is there a simple way to help retain flavours in juice such as cherry and plum.
Its common for cherry to dissipate and fade.
I know some companies add enhancers to juice like vape wizzard but i am a simple diyer and one of the main reasons i chose to make my own was that i would know what i was vaping.

See my reply below,

cheers

 

[zouzounaki]

Hi Zouzounaki.

One of the main flavour identifying components of Dill is a molecule called d-Carvone (or R-(-) Carvone) , your use of spearmint was along the right lines but the flavour identifying component of Spearmint is l-Carvone ( or S-(-) Carvone) . These two molecules are optical isomers of each other, 3 dimensional mirror images if you like and they taste quite different from one another.
d-Carvone and l-Carvone are often used to demonstrate how isomerism determines odour so thanks for your question as it's really relevent to flavour chemistry.

So, you need a source of d-Carvone and apart from Dill the best option is Caraway.
You can buy samples of Dill Oil and Caraway Oil online if you do a search.
Just be aware though that the problem with using essential oils like this is that they contain terpenes, which are not particularly soluble in PG and less so in VG.

I personally don't like vaping terpenes.....you may not want to either.


You could make a "wash" of these in PG, to remove the terpenes.
Once you've got hold of a sample of one of these oils, providing you are happy to give it a go, let me know and if you want , I can talk you through it. It should work............you need a few bits and bobs but it's quite straight forward.

As for salty, that's a tough one. Good old Sodium Chloride will dissolve in PG but I'm not sure if it'll come through on the vape and may well have a go at your coil.
Lo Salt products may work better, they contain Pottasium Chloride which has a more immediate "hit".

Whatever you try, just be aware of what you're vaping, your health is more important than creating a good juice.

Good luck

Hi @TheFlavourist , I ordered a small 10ml of dill essential oil. I’ll post in the thread here when it arrives, hopefully later in the week, if you’d still be happy to provide instructions for a pg wash. Thanks!

 

[TheFlavourist]

Hi @TheFlavourist , I ordered a small 10ml of dill essential oil. I’ll post in the thread here when it arrives, hopefully later in the week, if you’d still be alhapoy to provide instructions for a pg wash. Thanks!

Instructions are simple :


Mix 2ml of Dill Oil with 8ml of PG in a clean, clear , colourless 10ml eliquid bottle, push the dripper plug in place, put the cap on, shake well, leave it to stand for 10 mins, shake well again.Repeat this a few more times. Give it one last good shake , then put the bottle, upside down, in the fridge for 24 hours, it's really important that the bottle is upside down.
Do not turn the bottle the right way up.
It'll be tempting to leave it for less than 24 hours but you''ll get a better wash after 24 hours than you will after 12.

The liquid should separate into two phases, it may be difficult to see the difference between the two. The thin oily slick on the top contains the non-soluble terpenes, the bottom phase (the washed oil) should contain d-carvone dissolved in the PG.

Keeping the bottle upside down and without causing the two phases to remix , you need to remove the cap and gently squeeze the bottle to dispense the lower phase, leaving the upper, terpene phase in the bottle.
If any of the terpenes accidentally come through into the washed oil phase carefully remove them from the surface of the liquid by absorbing them with the corner of a sheet of kitchen towel.

The washed oil should smell and taste of Dill and be nicely soluble in PG/VG.

If it works you've made a Dill Extract by washing Dill Oil in PG.

Good luck!

 

[Mr Ripple]

I've not heard of Cherry flavours fading so I'll have to do some research into why this might happen, but my first thought is that it it may be a function of one of the key ingredients in a lot of Cherry flavours, which tends to react with PG (it's the ingredient which smells like Almond that I mentioned in an earlier post) which reduces it's flavour impact. There's another, similar aroma chemical which is more Black Cherry like and which reacts in the same way.
You could try adding a small ammount (1 - 2%) of water which should slow the reaction down (unless it's already gone to completion . In which case it won't make a difference).
Water is added to Almond flavours for exactly this reason.
I believe that the "enhancers" tend to be just single aroma chemicals which give a subtle boost to a particular flavour element, not sure that will help here.

Let me know if it works...........

Thank you that gives me a little more understanding and direction as i could increase the VG ratio next time i use cherry.

 

[TheFlavourist]

Thank you that gives me a little more understanding and direction as i could increase the VG ratio next time i use cherry.

I'd still add a drop of water.
Because of your question I'm working on a stable Cherry Flavouring today, juicy and sweet without any harsh Almond character, I'll let you know how I get on.