Risk profiles.. or the lack thereof

[nikki from mars]

Midnight Toker yep... and agree with consideration and politeness in general but also agree with the need to defend vaping and be politically involved in order to prevent the whole arena being overtaken by antis purely for political anti smoking reasons that have no justification. ..

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Planet of the Vapes mobile app

 

[steffijade]

Spot on. Have to agree with this point whole heartedly. If vaping is to be seen in the light in which most of us see it then by being reasonable and accommodating we will not alienate those in which we are trying to educate. As ex smokers (many of us) we know the benefits all to well but for non smokers I can understand the uncertainty of health risks. Particularly around children or those with low immune systems, etc.


Here's one I made earlier using Planet of the Vapes

Nobody is advocating being horrible to non vapers and blowing clouds into their faces to prove a point or anything like that, the main thrust of my op was that no activity in life is safe and that antz who demand absolute safety from passive vapour need to be called out for their bullshit... although that got buried in my ranting apparently.

The 'particularly round children' angle is something that the antz have used for years to emotionally blackmail/guilt trip people into accepting smokefree legislation (the term 'tantamount to child abuse' was bandied about a lot prior to 2007) and nobody wants to be labelled as a child abuser. Using children as emotional blackmail tools is just as much tantamount to child abuse too imho (as anyone who's gone through a messy divorce with children in the equation could probably qualify). The potential harm from passive vapour to children is negligible in the same way as it is for those children's parents and how many of those children's parents regularly expose their children to plug in air fresheners or scented candles without even batting an eyelid but would feel aggrieved about passive vapour? Think about the hypocrisy of that mindset for a while and the absurdity of the 'oh won't somebody PLEASE think of the children?' angle becomes apparent when applied to vaping.

If you want to be polite and respectful to people then that's fine, go right ahead and good for you but please don't try to use children as emotional blackmail tools to try and pressure them into conforming to attitudes that are all about passive tobacco smoke, not 'passive vapour' ... there is a difference.

 

[gords1001]

I often encounter "I demand my right to fresh air" type arguments. The cunt making them generally stinks to high heaven of some noxious perfume or other and completely misses the irony of their statement in such circumstances.

They also fail to grasp the point "if you really do want fresh air, why don't you piss off outside instead?"

I can be quite millitant to obnoxious pricks too, if they'd politely asked me not to vape as it bothers them, I'd have no issue, when they demand I stop just because, I feel obliged to irritate them as I feel rude ignorance and stupidity should be challenged as hard as possible.

 

[Peeej]

Sorry but I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree on this.

The anti smoking lobby has become very bold the last 10-15 years and it's now acceptable to label smokers as potential murderers for lighting up in the presence of others. A lot of the more vitriolic antz feel justified in making an easy switch of focus to vapers and want to transfer that same demonisation on to us. That's unacceptable as far as I'm concerned and I'll quite happily challenge anyone who wants to transfer that dogmatic, hate fuelled ideology to vapers with little or no justification.

These people have felt safe in this persecution of smokers because they think that the passive smoke argument justifies it but with vaping, they're on the wrong side of the moral argument.. they just refuse to acknowledge that because they don't want to lose their sense of moral superiority.

I think you are slightly missing my point.

My point is that people posting abusive things in threads, is not the way to go.

This thread has not descended into that kind of thing fortunately but I have read threads in these forums and others where the responses have simply been rude. I can't remember where but the term 'f off and die' appeared in one thread I was reading ( not on here) but it is that kind of thing which is not helpful to our cause.

In this one Mr Antz has been called an Arse hole, its that kind of thing I am against. We need to try to win people around with well constructed arguments not abuse. We do ourselves no favours. By all means challenge, I am right with you on that but being offensive is not the way to get things done. Too often these things become slanging matches.

People also have to remember that maybe Mrs Antz died of cancer caused by smoking and therefore we have much more of a hill to climb with such people and more reason for him to hold his views. Soft words will general win an argument or at least be heard more than those who shout.

I have to point out again that this thread has been conducted, on the whole, in a good manner and I am not having a go at anyone who contributes here or, again on the whole, to these forums.

 

[steffijade]

I think you are slightly missing my point.

My point is that people posting abusive things in threads, is not the way to go.

This thread has not descended into that kind of thing fortunately but I have read threads in these forums and others where the responses have simply been rude. I can't remember where but the term 'f off and die' appeared in one thread I was reading ( not on here) but it is that kind of thing which is not helpful to our cause.

In this one Mr Antz has been called an Arse hole, its that kind of thing I am against. We need to try to win people around with well constructed arguments not abuse. We do ourselves no favours. By all means challenge, I am right with you on that but being offensive is not the way to get things done. Too often these things become slanging matches.

People also have to remember that maybe Mrs Antz died of cancer caused by smoking and therefore we have much more of a hill to climb with such people and more reason for him to hold his views. Soft words will general win an argument or at least be heard more than those who shout.

I have to point out again that this thread has been conducted, on the whole, in a good manner and I am not having a go at anyone who contributes here or, again on the whole, to these forums.

I can understand your point of view and respect it but I've been engaging with the antz on various forums for a good few years now and have seen the hatred they spout and also been called a few choice names myself.

Gandhi said an eye for an eye and the whole world goes blind.. lovely sentiment but he ended up getting shot to death.

Pandering to the kind of people that take part in forum discussions merely to try and troll/discredit vapers doesn't do any good. This sort bigot needs to be trolled right back and shown to be the bigot that he is.

I have had some exchanges with antz that have been constructive but by and large, the general level of commentary from antz is littered with negative (and usually emotive) terminology. These kind of people haven't lost Mrs Antz to smoking related disease because she would have been divorced for failing to quit or never even married in the first place. All they're interested in doing is bashing people who they think are inferior to themselves (normally smokers but they're turning on vapers of late).

Sorry, but I refuse to play nice with smug, ignorant, jumped up idiots such as these. They get trolled right back and shown up for being the hate fueled bigots that they are because folk like them have closed minds and will never accept vaping regardless, so why even bother trying to be nice?

I'll stick to what you give is what you get and an eye for an eye where they're concerned.

 

[Chegs]

Why bother with pretending?
Why don't you either carry on smoking,or stop all together?

These 2 comments were left in several media stories comments.

Myself,I'm often asked why I'm still vaping if I was stopping smoking & when I pointed out I hadn't smoked in a year,I was then shouted down as "it still contains nicotine!" to which my usual polite response was "and your point is?"

I will always try & educate the ANTZ,in as polite a manner as they use when debating but when they resort to insults,I am easily provoked to my stock reply of...

"Which half of fuck off do you not understand?" and resume whatever.

I have told this tale more than once,but here it is again...

I was ordered to partake of a computer course,the company running it had absolutely no objection to any of us vaping in the classrooms.I then had another course dumped on me,that had the same company running it but in a different town.I refrained from vaping until I had asked if it was okay,but my tutor said she couldn't give me permission.She said she would ask her Boss though,so I refrained from vaping the whole day.As soon as I had signed in next day,I again asked my tutor what had been the result of my enquiry about using my gear.She said that she hadn't been told an answer but had I not had a word from her Boss.I still abstained from vaping indoors if there were any tutors around,and when finally my tutors Boss wandered in the classroom,I instantly inquired if I could vape.She took one look at my gear(box mod+RDA) and asked if it was to help with my breathing,I merely sighed & nodded which got my tutors Boss to agree I could use my gear indoors,on condition nobody else in the class objected.They were all happy to allow me to vape(said it smelled like hot jam..Summer Fruits DIY)so I started blowing my clouds(not quite weather fronts,but thicker than the usual clearo types)at which point my tutor muttered that I wasn't actually allowed to smoke(sigh)but that I was going to be ignored.I finished the 3 week course with no problems over my vaping,apart from 1 lunchtime where I wrongly assumed all the tutors were away and my cloud drifted out the open door and another tutor stuck her head round the door and explained she wondered who was smoking but quickly realised it was vapour.

I have had smokers swearing at me outside for daring to allow my vapour cloud to drift across them,the response was the usual "which half of..." I have requested a smoker to please cease blowing his smoke over me,he swore at me then shot off across the carpark on his disability scooter.

I frequently find myself screaming at the ANTZ,but not out loud.Just in my head as I dream of wiping the smug grin off their face with something heavy.Were it not for my imagination,I'd probably be serving a jail sentence by now

 

[SublimeSparo]

ETS Exposure well considering that in all likelyhood passive smoking isn't harmful I very much doubt that passive vaping does anything more than make a room smell nice, although it could be discomforting if someone had a severe PG allergy.
Don't even get me started on passive perfuming- used to almost end up with asthma attacks and breathing problems when i was a shelf-stacker in a supermarket... does anyone really need that much perfume on? Do you smell like shit or something?