Banned From Vaping?

[jediknight129]

old thread buuut I thought it would be interesting to see if anything has changed wrt perception of vaping since the scare stories ramped up.

I ask first and have rarely been refused, pass out literature on it, southern trains don't have a policy other than don't be a cock about it. Even wetherspoons mostly don't care. Sam Smith pubs are arseholes about it I got a really rude letter from corporate when I asked to clarify their policy

Hell I am the reason Harkers in york allows vaping now, a member of staff really apologetically said it had been banned by head office as someone had been offended, I'd been vaping in there with mates from GW for about 6 months by that point, I talked to the manager, emailed her a load of info, mentioned the vape meetups and the fact I had mentioned on the forums that the pub had cracking beer and was vape friendly. She took my work to a national meeting and got the policy lifted.

Most of the time I am polite however when I was in a club vaping with permission, some woman came up and had a whinge, I was polite, explained even offered to let the one who was interested try my ego-t. the other womthat an stroppily tried to slap it out of my hand called me disgusting and that nobody should use them as they don't know what they are putting in their mouth.

I at that point got angry and un pure minded as my halo slipped and made a very very rude comment about the things a drunken crap club regular puts in her mouth on a night out.

 

[Chiefnutter]

Am I the olny person on POTV that AGREES with places banning vaping ?????.....lol
I wouldnt dare vape in a bar/pub, restaurant, coffee shop or any other enclosed space & I wouldnt even ask if i could vape.
Regardless of there being no smoke & only vapour, (as someone has already pointed out) when anyone that vapes with liquid containing nicotine you are still putting a higher percentage of that nicotine back into the atmosphere around other people when you exhale!....& just like smoking cigarettes only a small percentage of what youve inhaled is actually absorbed into your body...the largest percentage of it is exhaled & theoretically wasted.
Also considering the fact that the full effects of inhaling these liquids is still not yet known....yes its not as dangerous as the smoke from cigarettes & alot of doctors will recommend that people vape instead of smoke, but I'll reiterate... the full effects of vaping are still not known!.....we know most of the chemicals we vape are virtually harmless in small quantities as they are in alot of products we eat & use everyday.....but heating them up to high temperatures & inhaling them is a totally different kettle of fish!
When smoking tobacco was first introduced it was considered healthy & even doctors reccomended people to smoke...hell even doctors smoked when they were treating patients & hospitals had areas where people could smoke.....but years later the truth was known of the damage it actually caused....& this could be the case with vaping.....so until the full effects are known its no wonder people are wanting to be cautious.
I have a 3 month old daughter & I'm sorry but I would totally disagree if we we're in a coffee shop or at an airport or any other enclosed space & someone sat near us and started vaping....If they set aside a separate room then fine....but I certainly dont want anyone to vape near my daughter or non smoking/vaping missus, I dont even vape when my daughters around & when she's goes to bed I close the doors & open the windows if I want to vape in the living room....so in short.... Im sorry but I agree with the banning of vaping & think it should carry the same restrictions as smoking cigarettes....atleast until the full effects of it are known.
And after that little rant from me.............go on then.....;-)

 

[Panter]

Am I the olny person on POTV that AGREES with places banning vaping ?????.....lol
I wouldnt dare vape in a bar/pub, restaurant, coffee shop or any other enclosed space & I wouldnt even ask if i could vape.
Regardless of there being no smoke & only vapour, (as someone has already pointed out) when anyone that vapes with liquid containing nicotine you are still putting a higher percentage of that nicotine back into the atmosphere around other people when you exhale!....& just like smoking cigarettes only a small percentage of what youve inhaled is actually absorbed into your body...the largest percentage of it is exhaled & theoretically wasted.
Also considering the fact that the full effects of inhaling these liquids is still not yet known....yes its not as dangerous as the smoke from cigarettes & alot of doctors will recommend that people vape instead of smoke, but I'll reiterate... the full effects of vaping are still not known!.....we know most of the chemicals we vape are virtually harmless in small quantities as they are in alot of products we eat & use everyday.....but heating them up to high temperatures & inhaling them is a totally different kettle of fish!
When smoking tobacco was first introduced it was considered healthy & even doctors reccomended people to smoke...hell even doctors smoked when they were treating patients & hospitals had areas where people could smoke.....but years later the truth was known of the damage it actually caused....& this could be the case with vaping.....so until the full effects are known its no wonder people are wanting to be cautious.
I have a 3 month old daughter & I'm sorry but I would totally disagree if we we're in a coffee shop or at an airport or any other enclosed space & someone sat near us and started vaping....If they set aside a separate room then fine....but I certainly dont want anyone to vape near my daughter or non smoking/vaping missus, I dont even vape when my daughters around & when she's goes to bed I close the doors & open the windows if I want to vape in the living room....so in short.... Im sorry but I agree with the banning of vaping & think it should carry the same restrictions as smoking cigarettes....atleast until the full effects of it are known.
And after that little rant from me.............go on then.....;-)

I do actually agree with some of your points... I wouldn't vape around anybody, routinely, it's not that big a deal to go outside.
After all, as a smoker it's what I did for Years.
I don't vape around my Daughter, or anybody's kids, or any adult for that matter unless they are happy for me to do it.

There is one point in your text that I have to take issue with though, and that's because it's a line trotted out by those looking to ban vaping and is a dangerously naive one.

Yes, tobacco was regarded positively when it was first introduced to the UK. Yes, it was new, yes, no-one was aware of the risks...just like vaping (in a way)
But. This was 400 Years ago. There was none of the analytical instrumentation available in those days and medical knowledge was scant.
Now, we are vastly more aware of the risks to the body on long term exposure of many different chemicals.
If tobacco were to be introduced today, it would rapidly be found to be incredibly harmful and would not be considered safe, or be actively encouraged.

No, we don't know the full risks of vaping, but it is not comparable to the introduction of tobacco 400 Years ago, not even close IMHO.

 

[anthonyb]

I also agree with the large part of above, and don't really vape where I didn't smoke.
But this is to me the sort of thing that gets my back up.

you are still putting a higher percentage of that nicotine back into the atmosphere around other people when you exhale

And can you please answer 1 question on the subject of nicotine.
If nicotine is supposed to be such a bad thing, and is said to be so highly addictive. Why is my wife of 20 years, and children of 19 and 16, non-smokers ?
They have been subjected to my excess nicotine, all that time and yet they don't smoke. As for anything else I might be exhaling, that's a load of tosh as well. I was part of a toxicology study earlier this year, and one of the results showed that my exhaled breath also contained 50% less carbon monoxide than the average never smoker. With the average never smoker exhaling 4ppm and me only exhaling 2ppm, confirmed by doing the test twice. And when you take into account I was a smoker of 35 years+ and a vaper for 6 months, at the time of the tests. It makes my blood boil, when someone says "we don't know how safe they are".
They may not be "safe", but even I know how much "safer" they are to the alternative, for me and those around me.

Sorry, rant over.

 

[Maverick1956]

Opening windows and shutting doors is a bit over the top if you ask me!


Sent from my iPhone using Planet of the Vapes

 

[Miss Pepper]

Each to their own. But people, you do realise nic is in everyday food items too dont you?

 

[Chiefnutter]

Yes, tobacco was regarded positively when it was first introduced to the UK. Yes, it was new, yes, no-one was aware of the risks...just like vaping (in a way)
But. This was 400 Years ago. There was none of the analytical instrumentation available in those days and medical knowledge was scant.
Now, we are vastly more aware of the risks to the body on long term exposure of many different chemicals.
If tobacco were to be introduced today, it would rapidly be found to be incredibly harmful and would not be considered safe, or be actively encouraged.
No, we don't know the full risks of vaping, but it is not comparable to the introduction of tobacco 400 Years ago, not even close IMHO.

Your dead right in saying that & no we didnt have the technology available back then that we do now, which is why it took so long to find out.....when the technology did become available we soon found out...... im sure testing is being done as we speak on vaping, so we should find out alot quicker.

If nicotine is supposed to be such a bad thing, and is said to be so highly addictive. Why is my wife of 20 years, and children of 19 and 16, non-smokers ?
They have been subjected to my excess nicotine, all that time and yet they don't smoke. As for anything else I might be exhaling, that's a load of tosh as well. I was part of a toxicology study earlier this year, and one of the results showed that my exhaled breath also contained 50% less carbon monoxide than the average never smoker. With the average never smoker exhaling 4ppm and me only exhaling 2ppm, confirmed by doing the test twice. And when you take into account I was a smoker of 35 years+ and a vaper for 6 months, at the time of the tests. It makes my blood boil, when someone says "we don't know how safe they are".
They may not be "safe", but even I know how much "safer" they are to the alternative, for me and those around me.
Sorry, rant over.

Not quite sure where your going with this? I never said or suggested smoking around people will turn them into smokers!
They will however have been breathing in the smoke & approximate 4000 different chemicals you exhaled from those cigarettes....& if there wasnt any possible risk with passive smoking then why did they ban smoking in public places in the first place?
yes whilst you we're a tobacco smoker your family have been breathing in your smoke & it was absorbed into their blood stream....how do you know it didnt have any effect on them ? how do you know that it still wont ?
And to say "As for anything else I might be exhaling, that's a load of tosh as well"....thats just complete ignorance as to what comes out of your lungs...all due respect you dont know & I think you need to read this article about passive smoking.
With regards to the toxicology study you took part in, that only measured carbon monoxide levels which is totally irrelivant in this discussion, some old heating systems can emit higher levels of carbon monoxide than being in a room with a heavy smoker & although dangerous its nothing compared to the chemicals in cigarettes & possible (yet unknown) chemicals in vaping.

Opening windows and shutting doors is a bit over the top if you ask me!

Not for me it isnt, whatever is floating around in the room dissipates quicker than it would without any open windows & closing doors reduces the spread around the rest of the house.....just because you cant see the chemicals or nicotine in the air doesnt mean its not there!....that kinda reminds me of when I had my pet shop people that used to say "my fish are dying but my water is crystal clear, how can that be?".....my reply was "vodka is crystal clear but fish wouldnt live long in it".

 

[Colonelboom]

The amount of nicotine we release secondhand is minimal and already scientifically tested and peer reviewed, lots of vegetables have higher nicotine concentrations and we are advised to eat those. Then on to the benefits of nicotine which is now being given in medicine to combat brain degenerative diseases - nicotine is not the big bad that years of anti-tobacco policy has made us all swallow blindly.

Tar in smoking is the damaging compound, as long as we are not forcing people to inhale tar and other noxious chemicals then the ban is a moot point (scientifically at least), morally the argument is there simply because we all now know that every aspect of smoking is a disease on humanity and will end the life of all children and kittens within a mile radius of said smoker. The 'facts' we understand and accept are wrong though and as said are the result of an aggressive campaign to turn smokers into the reason for cancer and general social pariahs - therefore by association - vaping which emulates the act or action and releases a similar looking thing to smoke is also just as bad for the world.

I am more concerned about the traffic pollution, industry pollution that we breathe all the time TBH.

 

[Chegs]

I ask first if I can use my gear,if I'm told no then I'll ask why not and have never yet been refused after explaining away any objections.

I have also read an absolute shitload of various scientific studies that analysed the air in a room after smokers & vapers had been inside it.The verdict was smoking produced measurable changes to the air quality,vaping produced none.In one study,the breath exhaled by a vaper was analysed & it was found that the nicotine was broken down the instant it left the mouth so the only way that second-hand vapour could affect anyone was if they were kissing you.Nicotine is not the demon it is made out to be,they are investigating whether it can be used to treat cognitive issues.

In a couple of the posts above,the words used are similar to that used by the uneducated to promote scare stories(which sells newspapers)and are easily dismissed by a few minutes researching.In another study,the sample group were given nicotine/placebo devices & it was noted that even never-smokers didn't dash away from the study & buy cigarettes/vaping gear to cure the craving for nicotine that all the "nicotine is addictive as heroin" believers would expect.

Nicotine is present in the foods we eat,but how many aubergine junkies have you heard about? How many restaurants refuse to allow aubergine consumption in case they're accused of promoting tobacco usage?

If I enter a pub & am still refused vaping despite all my explanations to counter their objections,then I simply find another establishment where it IS allowed.At my daughters 18th,I asked if I could vape & was told yes.I then fired up my RDA & blew clouds even though my mate sat beside me sucking on his Ego/CE4 exclaimed that "bloody hell,your going to get it banned with those clouds!" I didn't get us banned from vaping,I was only pointed at by smokers on their way outside to smoke.Non-smokers sat at the next table completely ignored me/my mate and the only comments directed to me were to ask what flavour was I using as "that smells nice,what is it?"

I did a PC course,during the induction we were told that smoking wasn't allowed,when asked if that included vaping,she repeated that smoking wasn't allowed.I waited until I could approach my tutor and asked about using my vaping gear.She said she would ask her boss,she (her boss) asked if my box mod was for my breathing (inhaler) and didn't appear to understand my explanation of "it's a personal vapourizer to enable me to obtain my nicotine instead of smoking" She did say she would ask her boss later,and it actually took an extra couple of days before I received the answer "smoking isn't allowed but vaping is just going to be ignored unless someone complains" at which I asked my class mates if they objected,nobody did(they all said it smelled like hot jam.DIY Summer Fruits)and it was only after another tutor had observed a few wisps of my cloud drifting out the doorway that anyone said anything further(she asked if I was smoking,saw my gear & hurried away muttering she'd seen the vapour & thought it was smoke)

Weatherspoons say the reason vaping isn't allowed is because the staff are there to serve drinks,not police whether the "smoke" seen is a smoker or vaper. As a result,I don't use this pub chain ever.I don't even bother asking if I can vape,I just don't enter and go to pubs where I know it is allowed although I still ask first.

 

[Colonelboom]

And to say "As for anything else I might be exhaling, that's a load of tosh as well"....thats just complete ignorance as to what comes out of your lungs...all due respect you dont know & I think you need to read this article about passive smoking.

Ok lets break this down then...

Yes. Breathing in someone else's cigarette smoke (passive smoking or secondhand smoking) can increase your risk of cancer and other health problems. It is also particularly harmful for children.

Relates to tar primarily, none of which is in vapour.

Smoke stays in the air


When someone smokes a cigarette, the smoke from the burning tip is released into the air. So is the smoke they breathe out. Smoke can stay in the air for up to two and a half hours, even with a window open. It may still be there even if you can't see it or smell it.
This also applies in small enclosed places, such as cars. Smoke may still be present in large amounts even after the person has stopped smoking.

Again, Tar. No risk from vapour which is devoid of the harmful parts of smoking.

Risks of passive smoking


Passive smoking can damage your body because secondhand smoke contains more than 4,000 chemicals, many of which are irritants and toxins, and some of which are known to cause cancer. Passive smoking from all forms of tobacco is harmful, including:
cigarettes
cigars
pipe tobacco
hand-rolling tobacco
Frequent exposure to other people's smoke can increase your risk of lung cancer, even if you're a non-smoker. Passive smoking also increases your risk of coronary heart disease. Coronary heart disease can cause a heart attack, angina (chest pain) and heart failure. It also increases your risk of stroke.

Back again to tar - now the 4000 chemicals are also introduced - none of which are in vapour. This post will repeat itself rather a lot i'm afraid as scientifically and medically it is accepted that tar + chemicals are the issues with smoking and nicotine is just a stimulant drug with minimal side effects to the user.

Children and passive smoking


Breathing in secondhand smoke is particularly harmful for children. Children who breathe in secondhand smoke have an increased risk of:
cot death (sudden infant death syndrome, or SIDS) – this is twice as likely in babies whose mothers smoke
developing asthma – smoking can also trigger asthma attacks in children who already have the condition
serious respiratory (breathing) conditions such as bronchitis and pneumonia – younger children are also much more likely to be admitted to hospital for a serious respiratory infection
meningitis
coughs and colds
middle ear disease, such as otitis media (a middle ear infection), which can cause hearing loss
Children who grow up with a parent or family member who smokes are three times as likely to start smoking themselves.
If you're a parent who smokes, it will be hard to explain to your children why they shouldn't start smoking. Try to lead by example and quit. As well as improving your health and theirs, your children may be less likely to start smoking later in life. See below for where to get support.

My guess is you can tell what this points to - it isn't nicotine itself as we ingest this in a lot of our food which would otherwise be banned.

Smoking and the law


In July 2007, smoking in public places such as bars, restaurants and workplaces was made illegal to protect non-smokers from the health risks associated with passive smoking.

Brought in to stop people having to breathe in our tar...