The new normal // documentary

[zouzounaki]

^^ I'm with her

Plus...and not wishing to tar @Crewella with my brush... IMO:

"Conspiracy theory" is a term used to shut down debate and quiet dissent. Banning shit and dismissing people as idiots is a dangerous path. Much better to have an increase in transparency, education and critical thinking.

Certain authorities and governments don't exactly discourage conspiracy theorists either. MK Ultra. The US gov pushing crack to fund insurgents. Iraq having no WMDs. Army copter pilots gunning down reporters and civilians. These are the kind of things that "reasonable people" dismiss as bat shit crazy.

If our goverment had demonstrated more decency, honesty and reliability in the past, people might be more willing to trust them when it came to important stuff like pandemics.

conspiracy theorist types in my experience don’t actually want to have a debate. they don’t think critically. it’s very easy to criticise the government while taking the sensible precautions. you can see quite a lot of this on here, for example.

the examples you list are not conspiracy theories, because they have a factual basis and evidence to support them. what we call conspiracy theories are bizarre and far fetched theories with no evidence or factual basis. they are just made up.

 

[HAZZA1962]

I realise that any of the more err “fringe” theorists would say ive been sucked in by the propaganda of the mainstream.
I of course in turn would say they have been sucked in by the conspiracists.

the difference is the mainstream is backed by peer reviewed evidence and science - where as the fringe relies on pseudo science and testimony from fringe practitioners, with the odd fringe hovering scientist thrown in.

it’s up to each of us to believe what we want - I choose the peer reviewed path.

I know @HAZZA1962 has said there is no evidence lockdowns work - and yet the first one clearly did - we saw a massive drop in numbers.

we saw a huge rise when everyone was allowed To intermix at Christmas (the results of which we are seeing now)

it makes sense to me.

is there some hard peer reviewed evidence anywhere that not locking down works?
Genuine question

I'm not getting involved anymore mate, I hope you're right and I'm wrong or we're all in the Shit, and I've wasted enough energy arguing with people I thought I knew !!!

 

[Rickster]

conspiracy theorist types in my experience don’t actually want to have a debate. they don’t think critically. it’s very easy to criticise the government while taking the sensible precautions. you can see quite a lot of this on here, for example.

the examples you list are not conspiracy theories, because they have a factual basis and evidence to support them. what we call conspiracy theories are bizarre and far fetched theories with no evidence or factual basis. they are just made up.

Are they all though.... to look for other evidence, question it and post findings somewhere non mainstream, isn't such a bad thing..... take the twin towers and the third tower for example....something no right there if you ask me.

 

[ZT]

I'm not getting involved anymore mate, I hope you're right and I'm wrong or we're all in the Shit, and I've wasted enough energy arguing with people I thought I knew !!!

You get it’s fine for us all to have different opinions - yet still get on yeah ?

 

[Crewella]

^^ I'm with her

Plus...and not wishing to tar @Crewella with my brush... IMO:

"Conspiracy theory" is a term used to shut down debate and quiet dissent. Banning shit and dismissing people as idiots is a dangerous path. Much better to have an increase in transparency, education and critical thinking.

Certain authorities and governments don't exactly discourage conspiracy theorists either. MK Ultra. The US gov pushing crack to fund insurgents. Iraq having no WMDs. Army copter pilots gunning down reporters and civilians. These are the kind of things that "reasonable people" dismiss as bat shit crazy.

If our goverment had demonstrated more decency, honesty and reliability in the past, people might be more willing to trust them when it came to important stuff like pandemics.

I'll go along with being tarred .............

I also really hate the term 'bat shit crazy' to refer to someone with different beliefs (whatever they are). For me the worst thing about all this is the lack of respect, on both sides, for people with an opposing point of view. How can you have a reasonable discussion with people who are just shouting abuse? You just end up with a big fight and either side retires to somewhere less combative ...... where they then only speak to others that share their beliefs and that furthers their cause. It's self-defeating?

 

[ZT]

I'll go along with being tarred .............

I also really hate the term 'bat shit crazy' to refer to someone with different beliefs (whatever they are). For me the worst thing about all this is the lack of respect, on both sides, for people with an opposing point of view. How can you have a reasonable discussion with people who are just shouting abuse? You just end up with a big fight and either side retires to somewhere less combative ...... where they then only speak to others that share their beliefs and that furthers their cause. It's self-defeating?

A fair point there Crew and a lot of truth to it.

I’ll maintain IKE as bat shit crazy tho if you don’t mind - it’s kinda my line I will not cross.

 

[zouzounaki]

Are they all though.... to look for other evidence, question it and post findings somewhere non mainstream, isn't such a bad thing..... take the twin towers and the third tower for example....something no right there if you ask me.

you mean like alternative facts? i don’t think there is really any evidence to support the idea the towers were demolished.

 

[HAZZA1962]

You get it’s fine for us all to have different opinions - yet still get on yeah ?

I don't hold grudges mate, although it's hard when your being called a Flat Earther, Conspiracy Theorist or a Moron because you don't have the same faith in Governments, Big Pharma or SAGE, as people, who under normal circumstances, would question every decision made and every statistic published by them !!! Nuff Said, Hazza has left the building !!! (Mic drop)

 

[MHL]

Science all the way. Critical thinking and education. And wear a fucking mask.

What I dislike is the use of conspiracy theory / ist as a derogatory term or a form of dismissal. It's an easy slur. Most people will agree with you. But I think we should be encouraging people to question authority.

Yes, those examples have evidence, and it proves that certain elements of governments are capable of doing that kind of thing. So perhaps some conspiracy thories are not SO far fetched, and shouldn't be SO easily dismissed? (I'm not talking lizard people here).

Plus a lot of shit will go down where nobody has managed to put together evidence. (Just like loads of crimes get commited every day that are not reported / detected / solved).

What I'm saying is, even if you disagree and have proof that a theory is false / stupid, we perhaps shouldn't be so eager to criticise people who have not yet reached that conclusion.

 

[Rickster]

you mean like alternative facts? i don’t think there is really any evidence to support the idea the towers were demolished.

Just in general.... to blindly believe the narrative from governments and mainstream media is not on for me...... the third tower was not hit by anything, if I mind right the Gov narrative was that it went on fire.... and just collapsed like a demo job because of fire....aye right.
That's just me though.... thinking... I realised others maybe don't which is fine by me.