House Of Lords Vote Would Scupper TPD

[crustyfolker]

I don't think the petition "forces" a debate, it's not that kind of petition but it should influence policy change.
Three new EDMs, petition, motion to kill the whole TPD etc etc -- it all helps and worst case scenario is blind eyes turned to "infringements" and hopefully an early review of the TRPRegs.
If (I think it's a big if) the TRPR was "killed", the law simply reverts to prior TPD Regs which don't cover "e-cigs".
Then, the Govt might decide to introduce specific regs or an SI to control aspects of vaping devices and liquids or simply announce that these would be covered by existing legislation.
If the TRPR is "killed" the UK could be fined by the EU for an infraction.
All exciting stuff though and the vaping profile certainly has been raised by all of this following on the heels of the RCP report and Lords debate.

Highly unlikely the UK will be in the EU long enough to get a fine if we scrap the tpd rules. besides that other EU countries have different rules on things look at Holland with weed and prostitution. compared to France and UK rules.
A fine wouls also just give more reason to vote out, Germany already has a black bank balance that would wipe out all other EU countries red bank balances without them getting more money from any fine they want to give the UK. Hopefully we get the TPD killed and all the vendors can remain or restart their business's

 

[cheltenham cat]

Highly unlikely the UK will be in the EU long enough to get a fine if we scrap the tpd rules. besides that other EU countries have different rules on things look at Holland with weed and prostitution. compared to France and UK rules.
A fine wouls also just give more reason to vote out, Germany already has a black bank balance that would wipe out all other EU countries red bank balances without them getting more money from any fine they want to give the UK. Hopefully we get the TPD killed and all the vendors can remain or restart their business's

last i heard the bookies who are seldom wrong had staying in at 4/1 on

 

[ossettbob]

I`m surprised that the petition hasn`t reached 50k yet. It shows how interested, or complacent, people are. We need to keep pushing this thread.

 

[Major Hazzard]

I`m surprised that the petition hasn`t reached 50k yet. It shows how interested, or complacent, people are. We need to keep pushing this thread.

I disagree..I went into a local b&m and was saddened that there was no signs about the tpd. I asked them if there was any reason and got a blank look.. The chap called over a manager who said there was information on the internet and left it at that. I feel sorry for those who aren't aware of the tpd but if it was my business I'd be telling my customers.
The manager didn't really care even when I pointed out that the majority of their stock will be banned in a year.
I'm sure that many capers just don't know.

 

[crustyfolker]

last i heard the bookies who are seldom wrong had staying in at 4/1 on

Being a former betting shop manager i can tell you this. The way bookies make money is favourites losing. The odds are set because that is what gamblers are hoping wins. Nothing to do with who will win
What won this years grand national, not the favourite. who won the premier league not the favourite.
So the point is bookies set the odds to come out of any event in profit of around 20% of the total stakes nothing to do with who will actually win an event

 

[Tubbyengineer]

I don't think the petition "forces" a debate, it's not that kind of petition but it should influence policy change.
Three new EDMs, petition, motion to kill the whole TPD etc etc -- it all helps and worst case scenario is blind eyes turned to "infringements" and hopefully an early review of the TRPRegs.
If (I think it's a big if) the TRPR was "killed", the law simply reverts to prior TPD Regs which don't cover "e-cigs".
Then, the Govt might decide to introduce specific regs or an SI to control aspects of vaping devices and liquids or simply announce that these would be covered by existing legislation.
If the TRPR is "killed" the UK could be fined by the EU for an infraction.
All exciting stuff though and the vaping profile certainly has been raised by all of this following on the heels of the RCP report and Lords debate.

This mPetition is simply a show of support, it has no particular standing in Lord Callanan's motion. However the Motion is not for a debate - It is for a "Humble Address" - Basically directly requesting that the Queen overrides Parliament, it's been done before and can be done again...

 

[mannikon]

This mPetition is simply a show of support, it has no particular standing in Lord Callanan's motion. However the Motion is not for a debate - It is for a "Humble Address" - Basically directly requesting that the Queen overrides Parliament, it's been done before and can be done again...

Never wrote that the petition was connected with the tabled fatal motion (vide supra).
Have to disenchant you because it is only since 1994 that the Lords authority (without permission or consent of the Commons) to table such a motion was established.
The tabling of fatal motions is uncommon as it may only be applied to SIs and cannot amend them, only quash them.
Less than two dozen such motions have ever been tabled with, at most as the history is rather confusing, four successful motions.
The Sanctions Order against Southern Rhodesia in 1968 was the most famous successful fatal motion.
Fatal motions have had some success in more recent years on legal aid, tuition fees and of course competition within the NHS.
If this fatal motion to annul the TRPR SI succeeds, it will involve a lot of "unpicking" of affected or related or indeed amended legislation, reversion to prior Regulations regarding genuine tobacco products, possible compensation packages to the Tobacco Industry and of course infraction penalties to the EU irrespective of the EU Referendum outcome. If the motion fails it will still have an impact in the UK on the application of the Regs, how we will have to wait and see. Either outcome of the motion will also have an impact on legal cases around the world. We live in interesting times.

 

[Tubbyengineer]

Nope, didn't think you did say the petition was connected with the Fatal motion, I thought I'd seen somewhere that at least one fatal motion had succeeded, so you're pretty much confirming what I thought. Even if it doesn't succeed I'm sure it will have an effect - because as you say, Fatal motions aren't often tabled so when they are it tends to get peoples attention in government.

 

[mannikon]

It certainly has got government attention