Old vaper, noob to TC...

[danb]

@trouserferret that looks like a good Ni200 build to me. Resistance is good, wraps are nicely spaced, amount of cotton looks good. I'd say you nailed it.

For wattage, you just need enough to hit temp. I find if it's set too high on some mods the abrupt power drop off doesn't give the best vape. For my setups, which are mostly single coil with fairly restricted airflow, 25W is normally plenty (it drops to around 15W during the vape anyway). I've never needed more than 50W, but there are of course scenarios in which more power might be useful. You can vape it in front of a mirror and check the screen to see what's happening if you're curious, but if it's vaping smoothly I'd just leave it alone.

I also find 245C toasts the flavour, I generally don't exceed 220C and normally settle in around 210C.

I find shorter coils (6-8 wraps) perform better, presumably because with a shorter heated area of wick, the juice doesn't have to flow as far to stay saturated and the wicking becomes more forgiving. Unless you single coil, 6-8 wraps is not really feasible with Ni200 because you wouldn't have enough resistance for accurate temp sensing - this is why I use NiFe30 and NiFe48, which require fewer wraps to to reach an appropriate resistance (about 0.15 and 0.20 respectively). Ti is also good in this respect, but I find it a bit of a pain to handle. For SS, you've got to build similar to how you would with Ni200 to have high accuracy (which is why I don't use SS).

 

[trouserferret]

Cheers @danb, I've got roll of vacuum annealed Ti and SS 317L to play with too. Just thought I'd throw a Ni200 coil on there to see how it performed. A wealth of info there.

It's a learning curve right enough, I can build you a coil to your liking with traditional methods - but this new fangled gubbins has me tinkering like a tinkery thing! Set it to 220°C, seems to bring out the most in the juice. Any lower and I'm not getting the kick, any more and I'm burning summat somewhere.Watching the readout, it's hitting around 21-23w, so reckon I could drop that a bit to eliminate any quick burn issues (can hit cut-out pretty quick)? I've another Derringer on order which shall be TC only (Snapdragon is in my basket), as it's been my favourite dripper so far. Enjoying the new options, hope I'll be able to contribute to folks after a bit of experimentation. Tell you what though, that Ni200 was a joy to work with. If the 30/48 is anything like it, I'll be shopping again very soon. A spaced coil was a doddle with that stuff...

Cheers, Apes!

 

[trouserferret]

On a side note, I wasn't particularly impressed with the TVF4 Mini. Set it up with the Dual Clapton pre-built, had a few puffs at varied watts and it was... okay.

Nothing special, but decided to swap it out for the Goblin (which has been just amazing since day one) overnight only to come back to a pool of liquid and an empty tank. Coil primed, airholes closed when filling sat upright, SMOK ring in place over funky flip-out top cap. Reminds me of my Kayfun. I never got on with that. Either gurgled, leaked or did both at once and flooded my pocket and caused no end of consternation. I'll give the RBA section a try, as I now have super space-age wire technology at my ever tinkering fingertips and an (almost) infinite amount of patience. I stuck with the pissing Kayfun for months, determined to get it right, even tried to give it away on another forum as the frustration grew...

I'm thinking dripping is the only way I'll get my fix bar the Goblin, and that is a complete juice whore. Think I'd need 9ml to see me through a day.

 

[jacquesy90]

Anyways, couple of piccies. Wicked loose and tried to keep the coils tight without contact, seems alright, but not quite what I'm used to. I guess years with NiCr and Kanthal has me in a different mindset. Struggling to find the same vape despite clicking all the buttons...

View attachment 75779 View attachment 75780 View attachment 75781

Did you take that pic before you locked the resistance?

Make sure its locked in at room temp or it will throw your vape off.

 

[trouserferret]

Did you take that pic before you locked the resistance?

Make sure its locked in at room temp or it will throw your vape off.

Followed the instructions to the T. Locked at room temperature about ten minutes after building, so should be good.

 

[scrumpox]

My observation would be about the airflow ... the relatively small air holes given the length of the coils. The build just doesn't seem optimal for that atty.

 

[trouserferret]

My observation would be about the airflow ... the relatively small air holes given the length of the coils. The build just doesn't seem optimal for that atty.

Aye, I had that query myself. Usually (with Kanthal) it'd be quite a small build in there, directly over the airholes. I'll try wrapping a few less coils on it, as the VTC mini claims it'll run temp control builds down to 0.05ohm. It seems to produce okay, but just not what I was expecting. I'll run this 'til it's dry and have another dabble, see if I can't iron out the issues.

Cheers for the help!

 

[scrumpox]

Aye, I had that query myself. Usually (with Kanthal) it'd be quite a small build in there, directly over the airholes. I'll try wrapping a few less coils on it, as the VTC mini claims it'll run temp control builds down to 0.05ohm. It seems to produce okay, but just not what I was expecting. I'll run this 'til it's dry and have another dabble, see if I can't iron out the issues.

Cheers for the help!

No worries .... there's so often a compromise to be made. With Ni200 builds you need the wraps to get the resistance to get the TC accuracy and stability.

 

[danb]

I'll try wrapping a few less coils on it, as the VTC mini claims it'll run temp control builds down to 0.05ohm.

You could lose a wrap or two, but after that you might start creating new problems:

1. Lower resistance means lower temp sensing accuracy. Drop too low and the mod won't be able to hold a steady temperature, leading to an erratically fluctuating vape. Each wire has a different resistance at which its accuracy becomes too low for reliable TC, and the number of wraps required to reach that resistance varies a lot depending on the material (info/discussion here). Switching from Ni200 to Ti or NiFe will allow you to knock out a few wraps without compromising accuracy.

2. Imperfect connections in the device lead to resistance contributions. This is called static resistance (because it doesn't change as coil warms up). If the static resistance is significant compared to the coil resistance (the lower the coil resistance the more significant it is), it throws off the calibration and tends to overheat the coil. You can set your temp lower to compensate for static resistance (but this is trial and error because you can't measure it accurately), so it's not necessarily a major problem. The static resistance might change as parts expand, when you unscrew something to refill etc. On a very low resistance coil, these changes may be significant enough to disrupt the vape in an unpredictable way. Generally it's recommended to stay >0.10 Ohm to minimise these effects, and as you see this can be tricky with Ni200

 

[trouserferret]

Ripped out the Ni200 build and tried a bit of .25mm 317L. 8 finely spaced wraps, dual coil 3mm ID, 3mm legs. Secured connections, made sure everything was as it should be, but the VTC is coming back with a 0.68ohm reading?

I know that SS has different coefficients (and is inherently less predictable with the temp control functions), but Steam Generator had a target resistance of 0.1 ohm... Was pleasantly surprised with the build, a little springier, but easy enough to work with and easier to tinker with once the coils were in place.

Don't get me wrong, I've dropped the temp to 180 (even performs down to 160) and she's vaping nice, but I think I'm bypassing the important bits of the whole temp control by doing so? Tastes nice and clean, gives a good pull and hasn't burnt anything (yet). Should I just run with it and see how it goes?

Apologies for all the questions, but I don't want anything to burst into flames...