Addiction...

[dansus]

Nicotine has NEVER been suggested as physically addictive as opiates, so you've misread 50 years of scientific evidence, which is impressive.

Have you read that post in context? I was disagreeing with Mitz's assertion that nicotine is addictive as heroin..

 

[Woma]

Never smokers. Its a common term used to describe people who have never smoked tobacco in relevant studies.

Then it's completely not anecdotal is it?

There hasn't, and will not be a statistically sound study of the millions of 'smokers' to a small body clinical trial to compare smoking to nicotine addiction.

We do know, smoking is addictive, we also know smokers find it hard to stop, we know NRT works (vaping included), that's also not anecdotal.

 

[Woma]

Have you read that post in context? I was disagreeing with Mitz's assertion that nicotine is addictive as heroin..

And, as a pharmacologist I agree with mitz.

Yes, it is, but it doesn't have the massive social effects as opiates as it's readily available and cheap.

Did you read my posts?

 

[dansus]

We do know, smoking is addictive, we also know smokers find it hard to stop, we know NRT works (vaping included), that's also not anecdotal.

We were debating if nicotine outside of tobacco is addictive. The body of evidence suggests its about as addictive as caffeine. Some disagree with that, but they are usually mistakenly conflating nicotine with tobacco. (smoked commercial tobacco)

 

[Woma]

We were debating if nicotine outside of tobacco is addictive. The body of evidence suggests its about as addictive as caffeine. Some disagree with that, but they are usually mistakenly conflating nicotine with tobacco. (smoked commercial tobacco)

It matters not, the addictive properties of nicotine stay the same until evidence proves different.

I know loads of people who smoke socially, I've also spoken to people who use opiates socially.

The way nicotine effects body systems catorgarise it as an addictive substance, whether you like it or not, it is, it can't be changed, it just is!

 

[dansus]

The way nicotine effects body systems catorgarise it as an addictive substance, whether you like it or not, it is, it can't be changed, it just is!

I bow to your knowledge on that one, but in a tobacco control environment, the question of addictiveness when vaped is a hot topic presently and will dictate future policies. If, as has been shown, never smokers who vape low doses (ie 3-6mg) do not become addicted in a way that is detrimental to their lives, then its harder for TC to lobby for harsher restrictions on their sale and use.

 

[Woma]

I bow to your knowledge on that one, but in a tobacco control environment, the question of addictiveness when vaped is a hot topic presently and will dictate future policies. If, as has been shown, never smokers who vape low doses (ie 3-6mg) do not become addicted in a way that is detrimental to their lives, then its harder for TC to lobby for harsher restrictions on their sale and use.

No bowing!, I completely see your point of view, and I find it frustrating too.

Many of my medical colleagues, including my other half have seen the impact of vaping on the numbers of people stopping smoking tobacco.

I've said on here before, many Drs suggest vaping, but it's not an official treatment to nicotine addiction, they all know it works...

As a side note, I believe being addicted to nicotine isn't dangerous, it's an annoyance, smoking cigarettes is dangerous.

We're all on the same hymn sheet (not that I'm religious, but that's another story!)

Woma

 

[dansus]

Many of my medical colleagues, including my other half have seen the impact of vaping on the numbers of people stopping smoking tobacco.

What kind of impact have you/they seen, how would you rate the impact of vaping as a cessation tool?

 

[Woma]

What kind of impact have you/they seen, how would you rate the impact of vaping as a cessation tool?

I don't work in practice anymore, the fact pharmacies are selling e pens is president though.

 

[dansus]

I don't work in practice anymore, the fact pharmacies are selling e pens is president though.

Sooner they sort out the medicinal devices for prescription, the better. Be quite nice to have something over 20mg available.

Although, ive been testing flavours for BAT and PMI, they all suck. lol