Have your say - Creating a smokefree generation

[Toby iVapour]

I don't think there's any suggestion that we'll go down the US route.

agreed, there is no chance that will happen.

I don't know how you would know anything for sure...

I agree that it seems unlikely we will go as extreme as what they have done in the US.. but there are worrying signs that it could be pretty bad...

e.g. why in the "what way should we restrict flavours" question, does it have a "Tobacco only" option?

And why consult with countries like Australia that have had a disastrous (prescription-only) policy?

Why propose to copy a country like New Zealand to introduce a policy to outlaw smoking for the next generation, that as yet there are no discernible effects or impact of this law change there (due to no one being affected by it until 2027) for the UK to draw upon?

 

[LordOdin]

agreed, there is no chance that will happen.

Don't count your chickens. Laws have been passed that everyone thought wouldn't be. In my eyes if your an adult you should be able to do anything as long as it doesn't Harm or interfere with anyone else. I have been told to do things from 1 to 16 or 18, now i won't let any fucker tell me what to do, i have done my time doing that shite.

 

[Simon G]

I don't know how you would know anything for sure...

I agree that it seems unlikely we will go as extreme as what they have done in the US.. but there are worrying signs that it could be pretty bad...

e.g. why in the "what way should we restrict flavours" question, does it have a "Tobacco only" option?

And why consult with countries like Australia that have had a disastrous (prescription-only) policy?

Why propose to copy a country like New Zealand to introduce a policy to outlaw smoking for the next generation, that as yet there are no discernible effects or impact of this law change there (due to no one being affected by it until 2027) for the UK to draw upon?

because....

All the parties are in pre-election mode and trying to talk tough because of the General Election some time next year.

.. and sure maybe they are going to drag us into some weird US/AUS/NZ hybrid law but until that is a proposal and our MPs all get to vote on it, I don't think it's worth worrying about. They are going to talk to everyone because they don't actually have a clue. Maybe I trust the health professionals too much, but they've stood defiant in the face of all this nonsense for years and I see no reason why they would change that.

Plus I don't even think they will be in government by the time any of this gets a hearing anyway. If there is to be a spring election, then early next year they will have far more important things to worry about, ... like the economy, immigration, wages, housing, food prices etc. This isn't a vote winner and it could potentially damage them even more when you have NHS professionals going on TV saying it's the most ridiculous thing the government has ever suggested.

"why in the "what way should we restrict flavours" question, does it have a "Tobacco only" option?" - because for some reason unknown they think young people don't like the taste of tobacco vapes. ... but they are worried about them smoking, which tastes of 'burning tobacco' and tastes worse, so which is it?

 

[Simon G]

Tobacco only for disposables wouldn't be such a bad idea anyway, it might cut down sales on those to the point they aren't a problem and everyone else can carry on vaping whatever they like.

... and those smokers that claim they can't continue to vape without disposables would still have a choice, vape tobacco flavours or smoke tobacco. Cigarettes don't taste of sweet watermelon with ice, so I don't really get the argument that they would choose smoking.

 

[Rickster]

Tobacco only for disposables wouldn't be such a bad idea anyway, it might cut down sales on those to the point they aren't a problem and everyone else can carry on vaping whatever they like.

... and those smokers that claim they can't continue to vape without disposables would still have a choice, vape tobacco flavours or smoke tobacco. Cigarettes don't taste of sweet watermelon with ice, so I don't really get the argument that they would choose smoking.

That would be the sensible thing to do....don't know about you or others, but back in the day a tobacco vape was my first try, cos it made sense this could be the reason some long term vapers still use baccy

 

[Simon G]

That would be the sensible thing to do....don't know about you or others, but back in the day a tobacco vape was my first try, cos it made sense this could be the reason some long term vapers still use baccy

The first vape I tried was only available in tobacco, it was one of those 'fake cigarette' things, the battery was in the 'filter' section (rechargable) and you screwed on a disposable 'cartridge' thing on to that. I think you could get 'mild tobacco' 'menthol tobacco' and 'toasted tobacco' (B&H, Consulate or Marlboro) ... it didn't work, but that wasn't the fault of the flavour, it was because it was not a great vaping experience... weak with very little visible vapour.

When I tried again with my first mod and tank I bought random flavours, coffee, mint, maybe vanilla or something. I don't remember but no fruits... you got to chose 3 'house flavours' free with the kit. That worked, but again it was nothing to do with the flavours, it was just a better vaping experience, 12mg nic and I was more determined to switch... the flavours weren't great, but it didn't really matter.

I think on day 2 I ordered some juice from vape club, mostly tobaccos.... a couple of Manabush, Digbys Oriental Plunder, some random nutty caramel type things too, maybe something like a gingerbread. I didn't vape any fruit flavours until about 3 years in. I still only vape them occasionally.

I don't really think flavours are that important at first... if you really want to quit smoking, have the right nicotine level and have a flavour that you don't mind and you can put up with, you can switch. It took most of us some time to find our favourite flavours, we didn't have them immediately and we didn't actually need them to switch to vaping.

 

[LordOdin]

I don't think Tobacco Flavours taste like Smoking Cigs, the tobacco burning can't be replicated. I smoked Roll-Ups for the Smoke more than the flavour, on the other hand i enjoyed Pipe smoking and could actually taste some flavour. I have had loads of Tobacco Flavours and some i have liked but i would say none of them tasted like a Rollie or a Pipe.

 

[Simon G]

I don't think Tobacco Flavours taste like Smoking Cigs, the tobacco burning can't be replicated. I smoked Roll-Ups for the Smoke more than the flavour, on the other hand i enjoyed Pipe smoking and could actually taste some flavour. I have had loads of Tobacco Flavours and some i have liked but i would say none of them tasted like a Rollie or a Pipe.

Exactly, that's why none of this makes any sense at all.

I think that's why it will end up being all about the 'naming and branding' ... the flavourings themselves are just flavour compounds, that suggest something when combined. It would be a nightmare to start legislating for every single flavour compound and which are allowed and what combinations they are allowed to be sold in. Half the e-liquids I've bought over the years taste nothing like they are supposed to.

I don't think it's really about what they actually taste like for the government, it's about 'watermelon slushie' or 'strawberry sugar laces' sounding attractive to kids. Also another issue with disposables that I hadn't thought about until going back over the 2016 regulations is that they cannot be turned off, so kids can just pick them up off a table and use them. I'm pretty sure that is technically illegal already.

 

[Toby iVapour]

Exactly, that's why none of this makes any sense at all.

And you think reduced risk products regulations make any sense in most of the rest of the world either?
(Over 40 countries have banned or severely restricted vapes & other THR products).

There's no point in trying to make sense of it, except to keep whatever tobacco control organisations happy...
(.. and in Sunak's case, an attempt to win votes...)

 

[Rickster]

A basic mint/menthol/tobacco/fruit costs pennies.....there may be a killing to be made for the survivors.