Should restrictions be lifted on the 19th?

[vapesmarter]

tested positive for covid with no symptoms they have covid, is this a conspiracy? no, you can have HIV and not have symptoms, TB and not have symptoms but it doesn't mean they can't transmit the virus

if they have no symptoms what are you going to treat them with? but on the referral, it will also say their vaccine status

 

[Mitz]

tested positive for covid with no symptoms they have covid, is this a conspiracy? no, you can have HIV and not have symptoms, TB and not have symptoms but it doesn't mean they can't transmit the virus

if they have no symptoms what are you going to treat them with? but on the referral, it will also say their vaccine status

He can correct me if I've misunderstood but I think his question is; are many of the official covid numbers and hospital admissions made up of asymptomatic people?

 

[Enoch]

are you a doctor?

No but i work with patient referral letters. and no, not respiratory ones!

But part of my job is to use a system that pulls up the information inputted by doctors etc whilst in hospital to direct them to the right appointment upon discharge.

I'm hospital? I seriously doubt it. Asymptomatic people were a concern from day one. No idea what the actual figure is but initially they were claiming as many as 1/3rd of infections could be asymptomatic. As I recall, many turned out simply to be PRE-symptomatic. Being asymptomatic won't stop you from spreading the virus and no hospital wants their beds taken by asymptomatic or even pre-symptomatic cases. Unless you need medical attention you isolate at home. This guy's obviously in for different treatment (knee) and as he's tested positive they're not gonna just bung him on a regular ward so they've put him with the rest of the infected people. IMHO and happy to be corrected.

the number of covid patients will be determined on how many are on the covid ward in each hospital. However , i had never considered this before yesterday but being on that ward does not seem to also mean ill with covid. So all it takes is for a patient to test positive for covid at any point to be moved onto the ward and they become part of that number. Whether their reason for being in hospital is related or not.

So given there is countless number of medical issues to require a stay in hospital, it is not beyond the realm of reality to consider patients are on a covid ward but do not require treatment for it. they wouldn't be kept on a different ward either.

Before yesterday even i considered a covid patient in hospital as someone with covid, so have been shown a different viewpoint from literal practical source.

 

[Enoch]

tested positive for covid with no symptoms they have covid, is this a conspiracy? no, you can have HIV and not have symptoms, TB and not have symptoms but it doesn't mean they can't transmit the virus

if they have no symptoms what are you going to treat them with? but on the referral, it will also say their vaccine status

He can correct me if I've misunderstood but I think his question is what portion of the official covid numbers and hospitalisations are made up of asymptomatic people.

What i meant was basically.

You go into hospital with, in this instance sore knee that requires treatment.
They test you whilst you are admitted after A+E
You test positive (or test positive at any point during your stay in hospital)
You move to a covid ward
Now the covid hospital patients will have you down as a patient despite your treatment being for your knee.

Because the covid patients in hospital is 100% based on patients on covid wards, because literally that is the number. Doesn't matter if you require treatment for covid or not, you are part of that number.

So where there will be a lot of people who are in hospital with covid and receving treatment, it does seem not every hospital case is ill with covid in the medical sense. That these patients would be at home 'fine' so to speak positive or not.

 

[Mitz]

What i meant was basically.

You go into hospital with, in this instance sore knee that requires treatment.
They test you whilst you are admitted after A+E
You test positive (or test positive at any point during your stay in hospital)
You move to a covid ward
Now the covid hospital patients will have you down as a patient despite your treatment being for your knee.

Because the covid patients in hospital is 100% based on patients on covid wards, because literally that is the number. Doesn't matter if you require treatment for covid or not, you are part of that number.

So where there will be a lot of people who are in hospital with covid and receving treatment, it does seem not every hospital case is ill with covid in the medical sense. That these patients would be at home 'fine' so to speak positive or not.

Yes, there will be some but a very small amount imho. Only people who are required to stay for other treatments despite testing positive would stay on a ward. Anyone who's treatment can be postponed will be told to go home and isolate and reschedule. It's also not uncommon to be on a ward for a very short time. As they've tested positive there's nowhere else to put them even temporarily whilst alternative arrangements are made. Can't just sit in the waiting room. Could simply be used as a holding space. Whether they still get counted I don't know but either way I'd imagine the figures would be very low, but I don't know for sure.

 

[Enoch]

Yes, there will be some but a very small amount imho. Only people who are required to stay for other treatments despite testing positive would stay on a ward. Anyone who's treatment can be postponed will be told to go home and isolate and reschedule. It's also not uncommon to be on a ward for a very short time. As they've tested positive there's nowhere else to put them even temporarily whilst alternative arrangements are made. Can't just sit in the waiting room. Could simply be used as a holding space. Whether they still get counted I don't know but either way I'd imagine the figures would be very low, but I don't know for sure.

Quite possibly, but let me put this to you

If cases are so high and prevalent, are you sure the number would be so low in that scenario? Potentially, the 0.45% vaccinated are these patients, and the rest unvaccinated are your traditional covid patients?

Which would suggest potentially that by end of september, the hospital cases would all but vanish once you have all the jabs finished.

 

[zouzounaki]

What i meant was basically.

You go into hospital with, in this instance sore knee that requires treatment.
They test you whilst you are admitted after A+E
You test positive (or test positive at any point during your stay in hospital)
You move to a covid ward
Now the covid hospital patients will have you down as a patient despite your treatment being for your knee.

Because the covid patients in hospital is 100% based on patients on covid wards, because literally that is the number. Doesn't matter if you require treatment for covid or not, you are part of that number.

So where there will be a lot of people who are in hospital with covid and receving treatment, it does seem not every hospital case is ill with covid in the medical sense. That these patients would be at home 'fine' so to speak positive or not.

did the guy just turn up at A&E with a sore knee and they admitted him straight away to a ward? it seems unusual. treatment for a sore knee is usually something that would be done on an outpatient basis.

 

[vapesmarter]

Quite possibly, but let me put this to you

If cases are so high and prevalent, are you sure the number would be so low in that scenario? Potentially, the 0.45% vaccinated are these patients, and the rest unvaccinated are your traditional covid patients?

Which would suggest potentially that by end of september, the hospital cases would all but vanish once you have all the jabs finished.

you are over engineering this you can’t conclude any sort of potential outcome from some confidential patient referrals to predict the outcome in September what it does is give false hope and fuels people going “covid is fake”

 

[Mitz]

Quite p ossibly, but let me put this to you

If cases are so high and prevalent, are you sure the number would be so low in that scenario? Potentially, the 0.45% vaccinated are these patients, and the rest unvaccinated are your traditional covid patients?

Which would suggest potentially that by end of september, the hospital cases would all but vanish once you have all the jabs finished.

I haven't heard anything to suggest vaccines increase asymptomatic infection. They were suggesting 1/3rd of infections even before a coronavirus vaccine existed. I believe most people who get infected have symptoms regardless of whether or not they've been vaccinated and it's just the severity that's altered. So in my head there's no reason to suspect an asymptomatic person is vaccinated. We also don't know when that individual contracted the virus and if he truly is asymptomatic, or just pre-symptomatic.

 

[Crispycritters]

If someone is hospitalised for anything and they cannot be treated as an outpatient then obviously must be kept on a ward. If they also have Covid then they must be kept on a Covid ward - if not they would probably infect the patients being treated in a non-covid ward, these same patients are very likely to be in the most vulnerable categories either through age, weak immune system or all round piss poor health and Covid, on top of their other ailments, could easily be the catalyst that broke the camel(s) back and caused more deaths. This would lead to a bunch of clowns claiming that it wasn't Covid that caused these deaths - it was co-morbidities, because if they didn't have these other ailments they would probably have survived (so Covid isn't really serious)

This example of the theoretical patient hospitalised with a knee injury who also happens to have covid (which in itself would not require hospitalisation) is being used to highlight the fact that there are some people in Covid wards who don't need round the clock treatment for Covid. (so Covid isn't serious).

This example is just manipulative bollocks, if the guy was on a regular non Covid ward he would probably infect and kill other vulnerable patients which would be serious, but as he is in a Covid ward he won't endanger others - and as he has a minor non life-threatening (for him at least) case of Covid he can be used to show Covid isn't as serious as we thought.

Total shite. Give it a rest.